IGX

During the mid eighties the Atlanta Falcons had very high draft choices due to poor
records. One of those years they drafted Aundray Bruce early in the first round and
Marcus Cotton late in the same round if memory serves.

They both were huge busts, particularly Aundray because he was one of the first three
players chosen that year, if memory serves.

Just heard a former Falcon QB state that he saw both players get crushed while attempting
bench presses with 225 pounds. To clarify, zero completed reps with 225 pounds and both
needing help by spotters in order not to get hurt.

That's too weak.

Aundray Bruce was the first overall pick and Cotton was the 28th. Cotton was a second round pick.

I also did not mention that they were both drafted as linebackers. Cotton was 6-3, 225 and
Bruce was 6-5, but I cannot locate a site with his weight.

I'd wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened to Joe Montana. In 2007, Kevin Durant failed to BP 185 and many critics thought he wasn't strong enough to play in the NBA. Greg Oden(no. 1 pick) that same year was pronounced NBA ready in reference to this body development. Oden's been a bust and Durant is mentioned as one of the top five players currently. I've read that Durant has since worked on his bench press and gotten it up to 315 lbs. in four years. Moral to the story, bench pressing is not a good gauge for judging success in prof. sports.

It is a good gauge of strength development in football players who aren't kickers or quarterbacks. I can't imagine an NFL linebacker who can't bench 225. Christ, I did that at 16!

Is it true that Wayne Gretzke couldn't even bench 180 for reps, or was the dude who told me that just pullin' my leg?

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:It is a good gauge of strength development in football players who aren't kickers or quarterbacks. I can't imagine an NFL linebacker who can't bench 225. Christ, I did that at 16!

This.

Bruce was a borderline retard who was pushed through school because he had size and speed.

He got to the pros and couldn't learn the schemes on either side of the ball.

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:Is it true that Wayne Gretzke couldn't even bench 180 for reps, or was the dude who told me that just pullin' my leg?

I don't know, but that's entirely possibly. He was a puck handler, not a goon, agile not a powerhouse.

Also, NHL hockey players, both goons and regulars didn't start growing past Extra Medium until not long before his retirement.

WildGorillaMan wrote:

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:Is it true that Wayne Gretzke couldn't even bench 180 for reps, or was the dude who told me that just pullin' my leg?

I don't know, but that's entirely possibly. He was a puck handler, not a goon, agile not a powerhouse.

Also, NHL hockey players, both goons and regulars didn't start growing past Extra Medium until not long before his retirement.

Well, I have no sports-related talents at all. But I can bench 225 for a set of 10 on a good day. I hope that I can still do that, and more, when I'm old. I can't imagine not being able to bench > 200 pounds.

Bob Wildes wrote:Aundray Bruce was the first overall pick and Cotton was the 28th. Cotton was a second round pick.

I also did not mention that they were both drafted as linebackers. Cotton was 6-3, 225 and
Bruce was 6-5, but I cannot locate a site with his weight.

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/07/10/sport ... -fall.html

a 6-foot-5-inch, 235-pound

DikTracy6000 wrote:I'd wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened to Joe Montana. In 2007, Kevin Durant failed to BP 185 and many critics thought he wasn't strong enough to play in the NBA. Greg Oden(no. 1 pick) that same year was pronounced NBA ready in reference to this body development. Oden's been a bust and Durant is mentioned as one of the top five players currently. I've read that Durant has since worked on his bench press and gotten it up to 315 lbs. in four years. Moral to the story, bench pressing is not a good gauge for judging success in prof. sports.

Jordan was supposed to be really weak in the weightroom when he came into the league as well - he didn't really start lifting until Detroit and NY beat the shit out of him for a few seasons.

Not being able to bench 225 if you are an NFL lineman or linebacker is a problem, obviously. The flip side is when pro teams put all their stock into the combines and ignore three or four seasons of performance.

Jordan also became incredibly injury resistant after he broke his leg. One of the first NBA players of note to put a serious effort in the weight room.

Figuring out if you're too weak is simple: If you play in the NFL at any position other than kicker or QB and you get pinned by 225, you're too weak.

If you're getting blown up over and over, regardless of the sport, you're too weak. Get stronger until that doesn't happen.

Hell, I'm fairly sure I can still bench 225 at least for one rep, and I haven't benched in quite a while now.

baffled wrote:Jordan also became incredibly injury resistant after he broke his leg. One of the first NBA players of note to put a serious effort in the weight room.

Figuring out if you're too weak is simple: If you play in the NFL at any position other than kicker or QB and you get pinned by 225, you're too weak.

If you're getting blown up over and over, regardless of the sport, you're too weak. Get stronger until that doesn't happen.

Hell, I'm fairly sure I can still bench 225 at least for one rep, and I haven't benched in quite a while now.

Yes. I don't know that I have ever seen a collegiate athlete not be able to press that. When did the combines start? I find it hard that any team would pick players who couldn't perform at a certain level. I mean, there was debate about Durant and he was only 19 and clearly one of the best scorers to come through in a generation.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1 ... 046,475039

1989 newspaper story that claims Bruce pushed his BP from 275 as a rookie to 395 before his second season.

Well, I guess Bob Wildes should stop listening to Michael Vick when they are sharing a pipe together.

At the NFL combine, bench is a speed-strength drill. AFAIK, the idea is that if you can't push somebody who is constantly moving effectively, you can't block or fight off a block. Basketball requires a different set of strength skills.

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:Is it true that Wayne Gretzke couldn't even bench 180 for reps, or was the dude who told me that just pullin' my leg?

Gretz said in an interview on CBC years ago that he struggled to bench 140 lbs. in the weight room.

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:

WildGorillaMan wrote:

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:Is it true that Wayne Gretzke couldn't even bench 180 for reps, or was the dude who told me that just pullin' my leg?

I don't know, but that's entirely possibly. He was a puck handler, not a goon, agile not a powerhouse.

Also, NHL hockey players, both goons and regulars didn't start growing past Extra Medium until not long before his retirement.

Well, I have no sports-related talents at all. But I can bench 225 for a set of 10 on a good day. I hope that I can still do that, and more, when I'm old. I can't imagine not being able to bench > 200 pounds.

At last something to make me feel good...I AM old and 225x10 is usually my last warm-up set before the work starts.

Tiger could bench 450, you know.

You'd think just about any professional athlete should be able to bench bodyweight but there's always an exception that proves the rule. I remember a Ken Leistner article talking about how Dick Butkus was a weak bencher but it would be a mistake to draw conclusions about his strength based on his bench.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/p ... index.html

A 200 bench on the old Universal machine, at 6'3" and 245 ... it's eons ago but it's safe to say Butkus would have been a disappointment at the combine even by his day's standards.

milosz wrote:http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1 ... 046,475039

1989 newspaper story that claims Bruce pushed his BP from 275 as a rookie to 395 before his second season.

I don't know what to say about that. Dave Archer, former Falcon QB, told the story I related
on 790 The Zone, an Atlanta Sports talk station, yesterday. He, Archer, claimed that he witnessed these two players in the gym with several other Falcon players.

I don't think the BP is a great predictor of NFL success, but those two players, Bruce and Cotton, were epic busts.

Cave Canem wrote:

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:

WildGorillaMan wrote:

Dr. Agkistrodon wrote:Is it true that Wayne Gretzke couldn't even bench 180 for reps, or was the dude who told me that just pullin' my leg?

I don't know, but that's entirely possibly. He was a puck handler, not a goon, agile not a powerhouse.

Also, NHL hockey players, both goons and regulars didn't start growing past Extra Medium until not long before his retirement.

Well, I have no sports-related talents at all. But I can bench 225 for a set of 10 on a good day. I hope that I can still do that, and more, when I'm old. I can't imagine not being able to bench > 200 pounds.

At last something to make me feel good...I AM old and 225x10 is usually my last warm-up set before the work starts.

That's fucking excellent, in my opinion. People can talk all day about work capacity and all that other stuff, and whether or not it's as important as many think, who the fuck cares. If you're strong and healthy enough to rep-out 225 for a solid set of 10, any day, that's a good thing. And if that's your last warm-up set before the work starts, so much the better. And I think that level of strength is a great thing to go for.

Wise use of the weightroom helps get non-freaks in the game, and wiser use of the weightroom keeps freaks going after 30. See Ken Griffey Jr.

BENCH PRESS IS EVERYTHING