The couch thread

Crust Bucket · Post by **Crust Bucket** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 2:37 am

So Jean and Couch are an item......Damn who knew!?

Fat Cat · Post by **Fat Cat** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 2:39 am

They deserve eachother.

Shafpocalypse Now · Post by **Shafpocalypse Now** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 3:25 am

This could be the most awesome question ever asked on the Crossfit board.

On a serious note, do we have any evidence that prehistoric man smoked weed? I'm guessing they were unaware that it could be smoked, but I wonder if they came across it at all in their travels.

Just asking from an evolutionary standpoint.

Thanks.

Fat Cat · Post by **Fat Cat** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:31 am

There is a lot of evidence that prehistoric man used Cannabis sativa in China in the 6th century BC, and perhaps long before that.

GoDogGo! · Post by **GoDogGo!** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:09 am

Fat Cat wrote:There is a lot of evidence that prehistoric man used Cannabis sativa in China in the 6th century BC, and perhaps long before that.

Is this carbonized seeds, or what?

GDG!

Fat Cat · Post by **Fat Cat** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:23 am

Remains from excavations. That much I recall. I can't recall if it was rope or what though. "Sativa" means "useful".

GoDogGo! · Post by **GoDogGo!** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:13 am

Aight, I put on my pith helmet...

Most info about vegetable matter comes from carbonized remains, esp. seeds, found in fire pits (which is why it doesn't decay.) Cellulose (like your rope) can survive thousands of years as long as it's in a dry cave or similar.

Oh, never mind the speculation; I found this fascinating page:

http://cannabis.net/hist/index.html

So it's all of the above: rope prints, hemp cloth, and charred seeds, from various areas and times.

GDG!

johno · Post by **johno** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:10 am

PaleoHighFit

bill fox · Post by **bill fox** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 10:56 am

Todays absolutely ridiculous pronouncment:

"The push-up's little recognized yet chief value is development of core strength which for the purposes of our program we've defined as "mid-line stabilization". Very few people can perform full range push-ups without deformations of posture."

Note that says "chief value".

Shafpocalypse Now · Post by **Shafpocalypse Now** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:01 pm

I found this statement to be, not only ridiculous, but indicative of how often high school athletes' training is observed.

Very few people can perform full range push-ups without deformations of posture."

stosh · Post by **stosh** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:13 pm

Mid-line stabilization is critical on a Totalgym.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:18 pm

Shaf wrote:I found this statement to be, not only ridiculous, but indicative of how often high school athletes' training is observed.

Very few people can perform full range push-ups without deformations of posture."

Twenty years of watching Navy PRTs tells me he has a point.

Shafpocalypse Now · Post by **Shafpocalypse Now** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:27 pm

I bet there's well over 100 people on this message board who can do a push up without deformation.

So, shove that up your ass.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:36 pm

Shaf wrote:I bet there's well over 100 people on this message board who can do a push up without deformation.

So, shove that up your ass.

Congrats, Shaf. But this is a pretty small, self-selected group compared to the rest of the folks in the universe. News flash: Most people aren't so passionate about fitness that they are ready to neck rape someone over whether or not a KB swing generates explosive power as compared to a BB snatch. In fact, I bet a hell of a lot of people work out so they can do stuff, not as an end in and of itself to be stared and poked at and argued about ad infinitum.

I'll say it again. 20+ years of collegiate ball and AOCS and mil training with PT and regular PRTs and working out in gyms tells me pushup form is usually not what it should be.

So, shove that up your ass.

metatron · Post by **metatron** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:44 pm

[img:640:480]http://mikesgym.org/gallery/images/blowing_ch.jpg[/img]

Grandpa's Spells · Post by **Grandpa's Spells** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:46 pm

nafod wrote:I'll say it again. 20+ years of collegiate ball and AOCS and mil training with PT and regular PRTs and working out in gyms tells me pushup form is usually not what it should be.

If you spent 20+ years in college, you should have learned that the pushup is not a great core developer.

Shafpocalypse Now · Post by **Shafpocalypse Now** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:28 pm

Pushups can be a core developer if you do them like

RON MORRIS JACKKNIFE STYLIO MOTHERFUCKERS! ON A MOTHERFUCKIN' HARLEY! WEARIN' CAMO AND SLEEVELESS SHIRTS! ROLLIN' WITH THE STRAIGHT EDGE CREW!

Nafod, I'll give you this: In sets of lots of pushups, you see degradation towards the end of the set. In populations that are weak, you probably see shitty fucking pushups all over, however, in the population that Crossfit is supposed to be training, there better not be bad pushups unless fatigue has set in, and, in that case, you might as well terminate the set.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:51 pm

Shaf wrote: Nafod, I'll give you this: In sets of lots of pushups, you see degradation towards the end of the set. In populations that are weak, you probably see shitty fucking pushups all over, however, in the population that Crossfit is supposed to be training, there better not be bad pushups unless fatigue has set in, and, in that case, you might as well terminate the set.

Well, I think that is the point. He's coaching people to attend to their form in the pushup.

I remember spending what seemed like hours doing pushups while Gunny Holtry USMC walked up and down pointing out why we sucked. Rest position was at the top, of course. And it did not take long before bellies were dragging or asses were flying high, as everyone's cores collapsed just trying to hold the plank position. The guys doing this were in shape too.

In a military PRT, you have two minutes to do a max number of pushups with resting allowed at the top. Try it and you'll see that holding a strict pushup position for two minutes is non-trivial for most.

Also, you do situps immediately before pushups in the PRT. If you shoot your wad on the situps, so to speak, it kills your pushups.

So while I don't do pushups solely or primarily for the core work, it is definitely there. In fact, I think the PRT should have them do bodybuilders.

GoDogGo! · Post by **GoDogGo!** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:56 pm

Pavel's got lots of PU variations in Bulletproof Abs.

GDG!

bill fox · Post by **bill fox** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:14 pm

nafod wrote:
Shaf wrote: Nafod, I'll give you this: In sets of lots of pushups, you see degradation towards the end of the set. In populations that are weak, you probably see shitty fucking pushups all over, however, in the population that Crossfit is supposed to be training, there better not be bad pushups unless fatigue has set in, and, in that case, you might as well terminate the set.
Well, I think that is the point. He's coaching people to attend to their form in the pushup.

No, he's saying pushups are chiefly a core drill. This is bullshit. Like trying to say the path of a KB snatch won't build power because he can't do KBs like DD, so he'll say what he does is actually better, not just different, or has certain advantages etc....

How about taking a Gym Jones approach - when doing any WOD only count pushups done with the body perfectly straight.

The statement is bullshit, but feel free to say that's not what he was really saying.

Shafpocalypse Now · Post by **Shafpocalypse Now** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:42 pm

Quality is important...in most cases it's more important than quantity. However, you need to understand when it is, and when it isn't.

However, I'd take a shitty looking 700 lb deadlift over a beautiful 400 lb deadlift any day.

On the other hand, in an ab contest, Mr. Foxy's defined six pack would handily beat my pony keg.

johno · Post by **johno** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:47 pm

I agree with Bill on this one.

When you pushup to absolute failure without resorting to the "Front Leaning Rest/Plank," which fails first: tris/front delts/pecs, or core?

DBID · Post by **DBID** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:49 pm

The best thing one can do is ignore the cult-like stupidity that is Crossfit.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:25 pm

bill fox wrote:
nafod wrote:
Well, I think that is the point. He's coaching people to attend to their form in the pushup.
No, he's saying pushups are chiefly a core drill.

You're a lawyer? Your statement and mine aren't mutually exclusive. And besides, to be precise what he said was, "The push-up's little recognized yet chief value is development of core strength..."

How about taking a Gym Jones approach - when doing any WOD only count pushups done with the body perfectly straight.

Sounds good to me.

The statement is bullshit, but feel free to say that's not what he was really saying.

I think the statement is far from being bullshit, and for a hell of a lot of people, they stand as much to gain as far as learning to hold full body tension by doing pushups with precise correct form as they do from the upper body aspect. Otherwise they should plop their ass on a bench and do presses. Pavel's one arm/one leg push ups take it to the extreme. Push ups with rings hammer the full body tension home too.

nafod · Post by **nafod** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:31 pm

johno wrote: When you pushup to absolute failure without resorting to the "Front Leaning Rest/Plank," which fails first: tris/front delts/pecs, or core?

If you are trying to max the rep counts of pushups, you're going to go fast and the arms/chest will go first. If you are trying to max the number of pushups done in a time span (military PRT), that flips things around.