IGX

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:But in December I cut my hand at work, needed an x Ray and stitches, and was told to return to the ER 10 days later to have the stitches removed.
When I went back, there were 6-8 other people waiting with me, and every single one appeared to be using the ER for primary care.

Not a new story at all and I'm sure anyone here who works in emergency services in the hood can support this never reported fact, regardless of the city. In fact, one of the best anecdotes I know is not one of my own from the Harlem NYPD days, but from a bud of mine in the Minneapolis FD/present day.....People actually time their 911 calls with the bus schedules. So, they get an ambulance ride to the ER for an 'asthma attack' or whatever, get meds and then get ca$h money for cab fare home since they are released when the buses aren't running. Rx's + Mo' money for 40s and blunts, yo.

IIRC, he said the cost of those rides to the taxpayer are in the vicinity of $1800/ride.

Oh, he's a hardcore union guy and lifelong Dem so it's not some angry right wing white guy blustering bullshit in case any of our bleeding heart types is wondering.

Definitely. They do not care one iota. Gotta headache? Call 911. Gotta fucking toothache? Call 911. Gotta upset tummy? Call 911. "You GOTTA take me. It's da law!". This subsequently leads to back ups and crowding at the ERs which lead to long wall times (as long as 8 hrs in my case) for us EMS folks since we cannot legally leave the patient there without signing care over to a nurse or higher. That leads to having ZERO ambulances in the entire bi-city area and 911 actually having to put calls on a hold list for the first available unit leaving the hospital, in the mean time they will send a fire truck or cop to "wait" with the patient to offer what level of care they can....thus leaving areas of the city with no EMS coverage, no fire coverage, and no police coverage. All of this because some back assward piece of shit is too lazy to go to the damn urgent care or Walmart for some headache pills. Our agency refuses to back us on this since they are deathly afraid of any litigation. This has lead to a huge rate of burnout among medics, which means many have quit...making the load even heavier for those of us who stay. On top of that the city says we make too much for what we do, gives a 1/2 a percent raise, while raising our premiums by over 5%.

I have made a person listen to the radio as a child was involved in a drowning literally a mile down the road and we were stuck with them for belly pain and they refused to let us leave. People fucking disgust me.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17wqbXR8nT0[/youtube]

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

DrDonkeyLove wrote:In defense of the ACA, if I or Mrs. Donkey get sick as hell and I need to change jobs, at least I can purchase some kind of insurance w/o going bankrupt even if it's not great.

And even more, my future geriatric gender reassignment procedure from male to "indeterminate" will be covered as well.

Meh, in those two examples, you can use the ER and/or 911 like the ghetto fabs, illegals, & trailer trash, have continued to do.

What I wholly credit The Obama for (in a good way), is doing away with the preexisting conditions stuff.

Great point. Pre-existing conditions and Mental Health Care were why BO could construct this Rube Goldberg of an ass-rape of an incompetent fuck up and KNOW it was gonna pass...

Why the fuck is an ambulance ride $1500?

I'll also give credit a little credit for the Pioneer program. They've found some ways to save money by attaching compensation of hospitals to their ability to prevent people from returning to the hospital after the initial care. I don't know a lot of details offhand, and I'm not gonna google it right now. I'll ask my girlfriend about it later, she's covered it extensively.

bennyonesix wrote:Why the fuck is an ambulance ride $1500?

I promise you, us on the trucks don't see it.

You have to figure that we only get paid maybe 30-40% of the time, from what I recall. A number of the ghetto fabulous don't even both opening the bills. When Uncle Sam is paying for everything, you can afford to just say fuck my credit and ignore shit like this.

There are huge price tags attached to the vehicle, insurance for the vehicle, fuel, drugs, equipment like cardiac monitors, liability insurance for the staff, and lastly the staff ourselves who are on duty for at least 24 hrs at time. All of which is at your beck and call 24/7. I am not saying that it should cost that much, but it is an expensive fucking set up seeing as how it is essentially a mobile ER trauma room that is capable of providing life saving procedures and drugs ANYWHERE. The costs add up, though I don't necessarily see it adding up to that.

Asked my girl about the Pioneer program, and she basically said its way too early to call that successful. They went from 31 participants to 19 in the first year. In aggregate, they saved a very small amount of money, and there's no way of knowing yet if they did so without denying service to little old ladies.
Nevertheless, the secretary of HHS announced in January that the program is being expanded rapidly.

Dunn wrote: A number of the ghetto fabulous don't even both opening the bills. When Uncle Sam is paying for everything, you can afford to just say fuck my credit and ignore shit like this.

Eggsactly correct. And, they don't go hungry and they don't get their smartphones turned off, either. Heat or electric turned off, or, eviction? DON'T EVEN GO THERE!

Meanwhile, low middle class regardless of color who struggle like hell and make just enough to not warrant social handouts have everything to lose and this shitball lumped on top did nothing for them. Naddating.

Dunn wrote:

bennyonesix wrote:Why the fuck is an ambulance ride $1500?

I promise you, us on the trucks don't see it.

You have to figure that we only get paid maybe 30-40% of the time, from what I recall. A number of the ghetto fabulous don't even both opening the bills. When Uncle Sam is paying for everything, you can afford to just say fuck my credit and ignore shit like this.

There are huge price tags attached to the vehicle, insurance for the vehicle, fuel, drugs, equipment like cardiac monitors, liability insurance for the staff, and lastly the staff ourselves who are on duty for at least 24 hrs at time. All of which is at your beck and call 24/7. I am not saying that it should cost that much, but it is an expensive fucking set up seeing as how it is essentially a mobile ER trauma room that is capable of providing life saving procedures and drugs ANYWHERE. The costs add up, though I don't necessarily see it adding up to that.

Didn't mean to imply that it was the EMT's fault. Sorry if it sounded like that. You all are caught in the middle of this shit storm... But it is your fault for trying to do the right thing!!!! You silly fux.

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

Dunn wrote: A number of the ghetto fabulous don't even both opening the bills. When Uncle Sam is paying for everything, you can afford to just say fuck my credit and ignore shit like this.

Eggsactly correct. And, they don't go hungry and they don't get their smartphones turned off, either. Heat or electric turned off, or, eviction? DON'T EVEN GO THERE!

Meanwhile, low middle class regardless of color who struggle like hell and make just enough to not warrant social handouts have everything to lose and this shitball lumped on top did nothing for them. Naddating.

it's almost like someone somewhere wanted more people dependent on the system...

By brother lost his job and health insurance because of the ACA.

Dunn wrote:

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:But in December I cut my hand at work, needed an x Ray and stitches, and was told to return to the ER 10 days later to have the stitches removed.
When I went back, there were 6-8 other people waiting with me, and every single one appeared to be using the ER for primary care.

Not a new story at all and I'm sure anyone here who works in emergency services in the hood can support this never reported fact, regardless of the city. In fact, one of the best anecdotes I know is not one of my own from the Harlem NYPD days, but from a bud of mine in the Minneapolis FD/present day.....People actually time their 911 calls with the bus schedules. So, they get an ambulance ride to the ER for an 'asthma attack' or whatever, get meds and then get ca$h money for cab fare home since they are released when the buses aren't running. Rx's + Mo' money for 40s and blunts, yo.

IIRC, he said the cost of those rides to the taxpayer are in the vicinity of $1800/ride.

Oh, he's a hardcore union guy and lifelong Dem so it's not some angry right wing white guy blustering bullshit in case any of our bleeding heart types is wondering.

Definitely. They do not care one iota. Gotta headache? Call 911. Gotta fucking toothache? Call 911. Gotta upset tummy? Call 911. "You GOTTA take me. It's da law!". This subsequently leads to back ups and crowding at the ERs which lead to long wall times (as long as 8 hrs in my case) for us EMS folks since we cannot legally leave the patient there without signing care over to a nurse or higher. That leads to having ZERO ambulances in the entire bi-city area and 911 actually having to put calls on a hold list for the first available unit leaving the hospital, in the mean time they will send a fire truck or cop to "wait" with the patient to offer what level of care they can....thus leaving areas of the city with no EMS coverage, no fire coverage, and no police coverage. All of this because some back assward piece of shit is too lazy to go to the damn urgent care or Walmart for some headache pills. Our agency refuses to back us on this since they are deathly afraid of any litigation. This has lead to a huge rate of burnout among medics, which means many have quit...making the load even heavier for those of us who stay. On top of that the city says we make too much for what we do, gives a 1/2 a percent raise, while raising our premiums by over 5%.

I have made a person listen to the radio as a child was involved in a drowning literally a mile down the road and we were stuck with them for belly pain and they refused to let us leave. People fucking disgust me.

If EMTs refuse to leave somebody with a tummy ache because, you know, paperwork, and ignore a person drowning they may be able to save, fuck them. Same for police or firemen, an accountant in a meeting across the street or any person who likes to think of themselves as a human being.

Yeah, disgusting.

Don't be hasty, Proto. It's not clear from the story whether the drowning child had insurance.

Phaedrus wrote:

Dunn wrote:

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:But in December I cut my hand at work, needed an x Ray and stitches, and was told to return to the ER 10 days later to have the stitches removed.
When I went back, there were 6-8 other people waiting with me, and every single one appeared to be using the ER for primary care.

Not a new story at all and I'm sure anyone here who works in emergency services in the hood can support this never reported fact, regardless of the city. In fact, one of the best anecdotes I know is not one of my own from the Harlem NYPD days, but from a bud of mine in the Minneapolis FD/present day.....People actually time their 911 calls with the bus schedules. So, they get an ambulance ride to the ER for an 'asthma attack' or whatever, get meds and then get ca$h money for cab fare home since they are released when the buses aren't running. Rx's + Mo' money for 40s and blunts, yo.

IIRC, he said the cost of those rides to the taxpayer are in the vicinity of $1800/ride.

Oh, he's a hardcore union guy and lifelong Dem so it's not some angry right wing white guy blustering bullshit in case any of our bleeding heart types is wondering.

Definitely. They do not care one iota. Gotta headache? Call 911. Gotta fucking toothache? Call 911. Gotta upset tummy? Call 911. "You GOTTA take me. It's da law!". This subsequently leads to back ups and crowding at the ERs which lead to long wall times (as long as 8 hrs in my case) for us EMS folks since we cannot legally leave the patient there without signing care over to a nurse or higher. That leads to having ZERO ambulances in the entire bi-city area and 911 actually having to put calls on a hold list for the first available unit leaving the hospital, in the mean time they will send a fire truck or cop to "wait" with the patient to offer what level of care they can....thus leaving areas of the city with no EMS coverage, no fire coverage, and no police coverage. All of this because some back assward piece of shit is too lazy to go to the damn urgent care or Walmart for some headache pills. Our agency refuses to back us on this since they are deathly afraid of any litigation. This has lead to a huge rate of burnout among medics, which means many have quit...making the load even heavier for those of us who stay. On top of that the city says we make too much for what we do, gives a 1/2 a percent raise, while raising our premiums by over 5%.

I have made a person listen to the radio as a child was involved in a drowning literally a mile down the road and we were stuck with them for belly pain and they refused to let us leave. People fucking disgust me.

If EMTs refuse to leave somebody with a tummy ache because, you know, paperwork, and ignore a person drowning they may be able to save, fuck them. Same for police or firemen, an accountant in a meeting across the street or any person who likes to think of themselves as a human being.

Yeah, disgusting.

Easy to say, not easy to live in that moment. The list of viable 'what if's' for that EMT leaving or NOT leaving is a mile long....granted, we have to say it's possible that by abandoning orders, they can save that drowning victim's life. Unfortunately, the odds of strong disciplinary action against them for doing so would be strong to severe. They're not dealing with someone 'in custody' like a cop, but they are responsible for homie's care, well being, AND activity until an RN takes over. Lots can happen there.....even with a bullshit bellyache.

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

Phaedrus wrote:

Dunn wrote:

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:

The Ginger Beard Man wrote:But in December I cut my hand at work, needed an x Ray and stitches, and was told to return to the ER 10 days later to have the stitches removed.
When I went back, there were 6-8 other people waiting with me, and every single one appeared to be using the ER for primary care.

Not a new story at all and I'm sure anyone here who works in emergency services in the hood can support this never reported fact, regardless of the city. In fact, one of the best anecdotes I know is not one of my own from the Harlem NYPD days, but from a bud of mine in the Minneapolis FD/present day.....People actually time their 911 calls with the bus schedules. So, they get an ambulance ride to the ER for an 'asthma attack' or whatever, get meds and then get ca$h money for cab fare home since they are released when the buses aren't running. Rx's + Mo' money for 40s and blunts, yo.

IIRC, he said the cost of those rides to the taxpayer are in the vicinity of $1800/ride.

Oh, he's a hardcore union guy and lifelong Dem so it's not some angry right wing white guy blustering bullshit in case any of our bleeding heart types is wondering.

Definitely. They do not care one iota. Gotta headache? Call 911. Gotta fucking toothache? Call 911. Gotta upset tummy? Call 911. "You GOTTA take me. It's da law!". This subsequently leads to back ups and crowding at the ERs which lead to long wall times (as long as 8 hrs in my case) for us EMS folks since we cannot legally leave the patient there without signing care over to a nurse or higher. That leads to having ZERO ambulances in the entire bi-city area and 911 actually having to put calls on a hold list for the first available unit leaving the hospital, in the mean time they will send a fire truck or cop to "wait" with the patient to offer what level of care they can....thus leaving areas of the city with no EMS coverage, no fire coverage, and no police coverage. All of this because some back assward piece of shit is too lazy to go to the damn urgent care or Walmart for some headache pills. Our agency refuses to back us on this since they are deathly afraid of any litigation. This has lead to a huge rate of burnout among medics, which means many have quit...making the load even heavier for those of us who stay. On top of that the city says we make too much for what we do, gives a 1/2 a percent raise, while raising our premiums by over 5%.

I have made a person listen to the radio as a child was involved in a drowning literally a mile down the road and we were stuck with them for belly pain and they refused to let us leave. People fucking disgust me.

If EMTs refuse to leave somebody with a tummy ache because, you know, paperwork, and ignore a person drowning they may be able to save, fuck them. Same for police or firemen, an accountant in a meeting across the street or any person who likes to think of themselves as a human being.

Yeah, disgusting.

Easy to say, not easy to live in that moment. The list of viable 'what if's' for that EMT leaving or NOT leaving is a mile long....granted, we have to say it's possible that by abandoning orders, they can save that drowning victim's life. Unfortunately, the odds of strong disciplinary action against them for doing so would be strong to severe. They're not dealing with someone 'in custody' like a cop, but they are responsible for homie's care, well being, AND activity until an RN takes over. Lots can happen there.....even with a bullshit bellyache.

We were on the fire truck that day, so no ambulance. That being said, we cannot legally leave. And for the record, it's not my call seeing as I'm not in charge, that would be the officer on duty. The kid lived, but the wait time would've been much less if we had been able to leave Joqueshia the ghetto queen. We've had a similar incident occur in the past and the medic and the lieutenant lost their licenses and subsequently their jobs due to abandoning a patient.

I can easily see that happening.

seeahill wrote:I'm not interested in a political argument here. What has been your personal experience, good or bad?

So, you started this, you lefty sojourner. What are your thoughts?

Well, as a lefty sojourner and all, I'm a little surprised most folks here have had a negative experience. As I said earlier, I'm on Medicare and have no idea the thing has been working for the people who need it (or have to get it.) What I'm seeing are reports like the above from Testiclaw out of Forbes. 86% satisfaction rate. But most of you seem to be dissatisfied to one degree or another. How can I argue with that? It's your personal experience, and that is what wanted to know.

This was the last polling I looked at and there seems to be no update... Anyway, I think the bottom line is that feelings are split along partisan lines... With the exception being those who claim to be directly effected by the law are highly dissatisfied.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/20 ... challenge/

This is a summation of the polling to date:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls ... -1130.html

538 article on public opinion:

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/ther ... obamacare/

seeahill wrote:Well, as a lefty sojourner and all, I'm a little surprised most folks here have had a negative experience. As I said earlier, I'm on Medicare and have no idea the thing has been working for the people who need it (or have to get it.) What I'm seeing are reports like the above from Testiclaw out of Forbes. 86% satisfaction rate. But most of you seem to be dissatisfied to one degree or another. How can I argue with that? It's your personal experience, and that is what wanted to know.

Yeah, that high satisfaction rate is a wholelotta horseshit. That's why we don't see interview after interview of ACA 'satisfied customers' that would have all the right wingers and pseudo rebublicans standing down with a big ole mouthfull of STFU.

seeahill wrote:What I'm seeing are reports like the above from Testiclaw out of Forbes. 86% satisfaction rate. But most of you seem to be dissatisfied to one degree or another. How can I argue with that? It's your personal experience, and that is what wanted to know.

Remember the audience, here. The idea that any idea not forged in the fiery-asshole of Saint Reagan would get a shred of support here is delusional.

And personal experience is fairly pointless, but for additional reasons; anecdotes aren't data points, and, are easily countered with, well, counter-anecdotes.

The truth is, most people like specific parts of the ACA, but, polling has shown that the approval drops slightly when referred to as "Obamacare". This is a product of conservative branding, mind you, but as satisfaction rates continue to climb, the right-wing will regret naming it after Obama. It's his, he owns it, and the sudden tendency to use the ACA abbreviation is evidence of this.

Consider this, as just a snapshot:

Conservatives have brought forward a suit over an alleged typo, and are looking to repeal the act because of this. If this happens, and the ACA is repealed, millions of Americans who now have coverage will lose it.

But, in typical Turd-like fashion, those same republicans tweet shit like this:



The truth is, folks like Turd, and most "mainstream" conservatives are, for all intents and purposes, stupid, and liars.

These reflexes become even stronger when offering "honest criticisms" of "Less-than-Conservative" ideas (even if, in a realistic world, said policies are actually right-of-center, but I digress). Remember the Heritage Foundation alternative offered against 'HillaryCare'. Which is actually a funny thing to consider: back then they tried the same "[Insert Lib Name Here]Care" tactic, but, they actually offered a semi-detailed alternative. All you have these days are vouchers or empty-metaphors.

You're a smart guy, Sea. You should have known what you were going to get from this forum long before you even clicked "submit".

The Venerable Bogatir X wrote:That's why we don't see interview after interview of ACA 'satisfied customers' that would have all the right wingers and pseudo rebublicans standing down with a big ole mouthfull of STFU.

We can start with one produced by an active, self-identifying Tea Party Patriot:

http://reverbpress.com/news/us/tea-part ... ion-video/

And then, of course, the numerous polls.