IGX

What the fuck
http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN18U0VV?il=0

#sorrywemadeyouhateus

As a measure of perspective, during the London Blitz...

More than one million London houses were destroyed or damaged and more than 40,000 civilians were killed, almost half of them in the capital.[1]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blitz

I think the Brits will do alright.

When I read this,

There is no longer any doubt: the mayhem in London Saturday night has raised Islamic terrorism to a new threat level to the Western world.

The van that plowed into pedestrians on the historic London Bridge, the knife attacks near Borough Market – carried out nearly simultaneously – reflect a boldness and brazenness on the part of the twisted warriors of the Islamist campaign to destroy Western civilization and force us all to worship their version of God.

I compare first a van crashing into people with planes bringing down towers or explosions on the subway, and then with real wars. In the London Blitz, 170 people were killed in a trampling accident trying to get down to the subway. The attack might reflect boldness and brazenness, but no war is going to be won with random small attacks like this. It's an evil to be squished, not a global battle for civilization. We had that with the commies already.

I don't know. In 2040 muslims will be 40% of the worlds population. Will it be a battle for civilization then?

The Ginger Beard Man wrote: ↑Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:23 pm I don't know. In 2040 muslims will be 40% of the worlds population. Will it be a battle for civilization then?

There's been enough of them for it to be a battle for a long time now. It hasn't been.

Nuke the Wahhabi sect when it spun up, and a lot of this never happens.

Trump treats Saudi Arabia as the center of Sunni Islam, but Indonesia is the most populous Muslim country on the planet. Now that we are a net energy exporter, fuck Saudi Arabia.

isis (sunni) just bombed iran (shiite).

a worldwide unified muslim movement seems about as likely as unified white dudes in the u.s. large tribes don't cohere. just ask the democrats. or the republicans, for that matter.

We need to keep playing the game....help the shiite...help the sunni....as maintaining chaos and disorder in the middle east dictates. We should probably start fucking around in Indonesia and in Pakistan as well to fire up the internal unrest

Trump's alienation of nations sharing our values is worrying.

What does a nation that loses respect for it's values and culture get?
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Trump!

nafod wrote: ↑Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:48 am When I read this,

There is no longer any doubt: the mayhem in London Saturday night has raised Islamic terrorism to a new threat level to the Western world.

The van that plowed into pedestrians on the historic London Bridge, the knife attacks near Borough Market – carried out nearly simultaneously – reflect a boldness and brazenness on the part of the twisted warriors of the Islamist campaign to destroy Western civilization and force us all to worship their version of God.

I compare first a van crashing into people with planes bringing down towers or explosions on the subway, and then with real wars. In the London Blitz, 170 people were killed in a trampling accident trying to get down to the subway. The attack might reflect boldness and brazenness, but no war is going to be won with random small attacks like this. It's an evil to be squished, not a global battle for civilization. We had that with the commies already.

You're right on all counts. That quote is symptomatic of the 24/7 media bullshit - desperation for a massive story - and it plays right into the cunts hands too. We had all this with the IRA, (may kick off again if we're not careful) so this is hardly new or different. Matter of fact reporting would be a better approach. IS thrive on all the glitz and glamour of high profile terror, so a lower key response is merited.

This apartment tower fire...terror attack? Disable the extinguisher system? I don't know. If it is a terror attack, it was well played. If it wasn't, they'll probably find it inspiring.

Johno, this is your turf...

cnn reported this:

in a blog post dated November 20, 2016, a residents group, the Grenfell Action Group (GAC), highlighted ongoing concerns among residents over the safety of the building. . . .
The blog post argued that only "a catastrophic event will expose the ineptitude and incompetence of our landlord ... and bring an end to the dangerous living conditions and neglect of health and safety legislation that they inflict upon their tenants and leaseholders."

grimly prescient?

nafod wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 12:15 pm This apartment tower fire...terror attack? Disable the extinguisher system? I don't know. If it is a terror attack, it was well played. If it wasn't, they'll probably find it inspiring.

Johno, this is your turf...

They didn't have sprinkler systems and the external cladding appears to have been of an inappropriate material. External smoke spread on high rise building tends to cling to the exterior, (called coanda effect) and may be in temps up to 1000 degrees, so if the building is covered in something combustible then that's going to contribute to the spread. The investigations will no doubt shed more light on it.

This is a result of inadequate funding and poor management. Not terrorism. I'm in the Fire Service and my brother is in a housing authority in London. Both services have been squeezed to fuck in the past ten years, same with police and ambulance. No-one really cared that much as we are portrayed as inefficient, self-serving organisations staffed by lazy people who can't get a proper job in the private sector. Sadly very few people with influence regularly require these services so it becomes easy to nod in agreement when central government slashes the funding of them. It may seem a bit tasteless to make a tragedy a political issue but it really is. This is the logical consequence of the austerity agenda.

This is the logical consequence of the austerity agenda.

I've never actually discussed this with my relatives in England Odin, but I would imagine it is the same as here (U.S.).

Politicians here do something called the "Firemen first" threat. Whenever a tax cut is proposed, no matter how much government waste there is in a budget, they always threaten people with the fact that Firemen, Cops, and Teachers are going to have to be cut back. Very often the follow through on those threats to spite people, even when they have twelve secretaries and the parks department coming to cut the grass at their mansion.

odin wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:24 am

nafod wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2017 12:15 pm This apartment tower fire...terror attack? Disable the extinguisher system? I don't know. If it is a terror attack, it was well played. If it wasn't, they'll probably find it inspiring.

Johno, this is your turf...

This is a result of inadequate funding and poor management. Not terrorism. I'm in the Fire Service and my brother is in a housing authority in London. Both services have been squeezed to fuck in the past ten years, same with police and ambulance. ...
This is the logical consequence of the austerity agenda.

I've seen fires hopscotch up building exteriors with amazing speed. But the horizontal spread that I saw in the photos baffles me. It made me wonder whether there were multiple fire sources (think "arson"), whether the fire partially spread on the interior, down hallways, or whether the horizontal spread happened because of some construction issues with the building exterior.

I have done many safety inspections on apartment buildings and we always found hallway doors blocked open, which defeats the fire door system and allows rapid interior fire/smoke spread, trapping occupants in their units. Theoretically, if the fire had just hopscotched vertically, then found a few open windows to get into a few units, you wouldn't see what happened in London. Not so completely.

I can't talk about London's austerity agenda. But once the fire got beyond the reach of the ladder streams, the fire fighters were WAY behind the power curve, budgetary considerations aside. They did ballsy work, evacuating & rescuing occupants.

Yes it seems the external cladding was not fit for purpose and contributed to the spread. One witness also talks of a blue flame which suggests a gas main rupturing perhaps. Most importantly, they opted not to spend 200k on sprinklers as they basically couldn't be arsed and didn't want to spend the cash. Shameful. I'm not actually a socialist but do we really value profit over people that much???