IGX

newguy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 9:39 pm
I have no problem with a path to citizenship for people who have been here. The government let them be here. They are here working, going to school, etc. etc. Having kids, raising families, all that.

What does it serve me to kick them out now? It's not their fault the government let them be here.

Let them stay, work, pay taxes.

Amnesty is an immediate and irreversible improvement for 12,000,000 illegal border crossers.

Status Quo until the Border is secured for at least five years. Then consider something like DACA.

Otherwise you are suggesting the deeply stupid move: An irreversible deed in exchange for a promise by a lying politician.

Reagan already tried amnesty and we are still dealing with the fallout of a failed policy that inspired the problems we are grappling with today. Nice guy faggot bullshit doesn't work in the real world, that's why California is a disaster area. Control the border. Build a wall. Kill invaders. A half dozen purposefully shot border jumpers and save the lives of countless people who die in the desert trying to illegally cross our border. Have the actual will power and moral clarity to do what needs to be done.

johno wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 9:57 pm

newguy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 9:39 pm
I have no problem with a path to citizenship for people who have been here. The government let them be here. They are here working, going to school, etc. etc. Having kids, raising families, all that.

What does it serve me to kick them out now? It's not their fault the government let them be here.

Let them stay, work, pay taxes.

DACA is an immediate and irreversible improvement for 12,000,000 illegal border crossers.

Status Quo until the Border is secured for at least five years. Then consider something like DACA.

Otherwise you are suggesting the deeply stupid move: An irreversible deed in exchange for a promise by a lying politician.

Forget the politics for a moment though. Let's say you and I are responsible for trying to work out a border agreement. We are not liars, our words are binding, etc. No politics.

I am willing to go in with you for full secure border. 100%. Part of that for me is fully funding and expanding the judiciary that oversees it along with stronger prosecution/sanctions for businesses that exploit immigrant labor. But I am good with complete security and no exceptions.

To get that, which is important, you wouldn't be willing to consider working with me on allowing a certain group of people who are here illegally a path to citizenship?

It seems to me it would be a compromise worth making. I am talking about people who are here, are working, are doing the right things. People who we have allowed to be here.

Either that or we end up staying where we are at, which is a situation neither of us wants.

Again - not a republican democrat congress argument. I get the whole dynamic there.

A thought experiment.

In this Thought Experiment, leave current non-criminal illegals at status quo, which is the best any of them hoped for when they entered this country. And a path to citizenship for those who serve in the military.

But in reality, nothing can work without real border security, not some politician's promise that has already been proven worthless. It's a thorny problem.

johno wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 5:16 am In this Thought Experiment, leave current non-criminal illegals at status quo, which is the best any of them hoped for when they entered this country. And a path to citizenship for those who serve in the military.

But in reality, nothing can work without real border security, not some politician's promise that has already been proven worthless. It's a thorny problem.

For your above scenario - I would work on a plan with you there. Instead though of status quo, I would try to see if we could come to something different. Earlier you had mentioned you didn't want to see anything done until the border had been funded secured for X years. I would see if we could come up with a plan that gave that path to citizenship over X years, along with certain milestones. For example you said military. I would back that. I would push for university as well.

Point being, that outside of politics, we as two reasonable human beings could probably get something worked out that we could both live with and would be much better for this country than what we have now.

But that is the problem with politics. As a politician at that level (congress) why in the world would I sit with you? Why would you sit with me? I don't care if the border gets solved or not. I care about my next round of fundraising. I care about getting selected for the posh committee assignment. Even if we wanted to, neither of us can get this deal done EVER.

The only reasonable path to citizenship for illegals already here is return to your country of origin and apply like everyone else. Other than that, get fucked. Any gay amnesty plan will just exacerbate the problem like Reagan, that doddering homo, did in the 80s.

Well then you and me are not getting a deal done then. The situation stays as it is now.

If you worked with me, we would have a fully secure border. Zero tolerance policy. I'd even give you roving packs of trained wolves.

All I'd be asking for is to let Isabella who has been here for 20 years, works, has kids in school, no criminal record, have a path to citizenship that doesn't involve shipping her back to Guatemala first. I'd even charge her a fee/fine. I'd be willing to extend the time the it takes to get that citizenship (reasonably.)

It doesn't seem like a lot to give me.

She's here. She's been here. We've known she is here. She's probably staying here anyways.

newguy wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:30 pm Well then you and me are not getting a deal done then. The situation stays as it is now.

If you worked with me, we would have a fully secure border. Zero tolerance policy. I'd even give you roving packs of trained wolves.

All I'd be asking for is to let Isabella who has been here for 20 years, works, has kids in school, no criminal record, have a path to citizenship that doesn't involve shipping her back to Guatemala first. I'd even charge her a fee/fine. I'd be willing to extend the time the it takes to get that citizenship (reasonably.)

It doesn't seem like a lot to give me.

She's here. She's been here. We've known she is here. She's probably staying here anyways.

Isabella is out. Her first act on American soil was to flaunt the law so she could grift off the American taxpayer. I bet she hasn't been reporting any income during that time either.

If you want to be her champion you can go to Guatemala with her, see if they let you in without proper documentation. I'm making the call...



Let me ask you: who made you savior of these people? Why do you feel compelled to argue for foreigners and against Americans and their own interests?

ABC's Martha Raddatz to illegal alien who crossed the border: "Would you have tried to do this when Donald Trump was president?"

Illegal alien: "Definitely not."

Raddatz: “Did you come here because Joe Biden was elected president?"

Illegal: “Basically”



Great job guys! A nation of immigrants amirite?

Fat Cat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 6:20 pm Raddatz: “Did you come here because Joe Biden was elected president?"

Illegal: “Basically”

Painfully obvious to anyone who understands that humans respond to incentives.

johno wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 10:45 pm

Fat Cat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 6:20 pm Raddatz: “Did you come here because Joe Biden was elected president?"

Illegal: “Basically”[/i]

Painfully obvious to anyone who understands that humans respond to incentives.

The Democratic Party has sold America out for votes. It's a simple as that. The have demonized the enforcement of American laws on immigration and now are stopping enforcement of those same laws. They praise those who enter our country illegally as heroes and shower them with welfare while Americans go without. Single adult intercepts are up 188% overall according to CBP.

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sout ... rehensions

Simple solution:

1) round up a bunch of single, military-aged illegals.
2) given them jobs on the Border Patrol
a) their job is to keep people out, after 3 years they get fast tracked to citizenship given adequate job performance.
b) if they cannot keep people out they are going to be deported.
c) occasional lethal force isn't punished
3) watch formerly illegal immigrants control the border for us.

Shafpocalypse Now wrote: ↑Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:20 pm Simple solution:

1) round up a bunch of single, military-aged illegals.
2) given them jobs on the Border Patrol
a) their job is to keep people out, after 3 years they get fast tracked to citizenship given adequate job performance.
b) if they cannot keep people out they are going to be deported.
c) occasional lethal force isn't punished
3) watch formerly illegal immigrants control the border for us.

I support formation of roving bands of Mexican Cossacks defending the far reaches of the realm.