IGX

Wild Bill wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:27 pm Biden:
“Putin may circle Kyiv with tanks, but he will never gain the hearts and souls of the Iranian people."

I think he meant the country you invaded unprovoked the other week. You know, the one where you are dropping cluster bombs in residential areas.

Unprovoked :)

nafod wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 4:08 pmI think he meant

I think he is almost as ignorant as you.

nafod wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 4:08 pm

Wild Bill wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:27 pm Biden:
“Putin may circle Kyiv with tanks, but he will never gain the hearts and souls of the Iranian people."

I think he meant the country you invaded unprovoked the other week. You know, the one where you are dropping cluster bombs in residential areas.

I know it's a challenge but stop acting like a complete fucking idiot. Bill and Sangoma don't call the shots in Russia any more than you do in Washington. I hope ALL of us who are Americans in this thread spend some time reflecting on the legacy of Afghanistan and Iraq because those massive fuck ups have laid the pretext for Ukraine.

Fat Cat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 6:58 pm I know it's a challenge but stop acting like a complete fucking idiot. Bill and Sangoma don't call the shots in Russia any more than you do in Washington.

Russia invaded a sovereign fellow democracy, and if WB wants to make fun of Biden saying Iranian instead of Ukrainian, I'm going to point out that his beloved leader is using mass slaughter of civilians while laying siege to the cities as his winning strategy. Tough shit if you don't like it.

Us looking the other way while Russia leveled Grozny is a better prelude than what we did to either Saddam, who gassed his own citizens and deserved a good hanging, or the Taliban, who are just evil

nafod wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:51 pm Russia invaded a sovereign fellow democracy, and if WB wants to make fun of Biden saying Iranian instead of Ukrainian, I'm going to point out that his beloved leader is using mass slaughter of civilians while laying siege to the cities as his winning strategy. Tough shit if you don't like it.

Russia =/= Wild Bill, dimwit. If you were a bit more worldly, you might understand that people from different places and times often have diverse views of current events. We, here at IGX, are fortunate to have several Russians both in Russia and abroad, and we should listen to what they have to say so that we can gain a broader, more nuanced view of the situation.

nafod wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 9:51 pm Us looking the other way while Russia leveled Grozny is a better prelude than what we did to either Saddam, who gassed his own citizens and deserved a good hanging, or the Taliban, who are just evil

Your beloved Clintons bombed democratic Serbs for daring to oppose Islamic Albanian terrorists who were taking over the oldest, most historic provinces of their country. Take a deep breath and think like a grownup for once in your narrow little life.

The facts are that we--the United States of America--were WRONG then. It's not simple, but that's a topic for a different time. The facts are that Russian Federation is in the WRONG now. The whole world sees the farce of de-nazifying a country led by a Jewish president and a Jewish prime minister while bombing Babi Yar. If it comes down to it, I know where I stand, but we should be doing everything to try to understand the present dynamics and America's role in it so that we don't exacerbate an already volatile and deadly situation.

President Obama stated plainly that Ukraine was a core interest of the Russians and not for us. So to continue to lead them to this very moment, despite knowing that they would get smashed, can be lain directly at the feet of the Democratic Party. You know, the party that stoked Russophobia for the past 5 years? If you want to know who helped author this moment, it's ill-informed voters like you.

Here's John Mearshimer, the R. Wendell Harrison Distinguished Service Professor in Political Science and Co-director of the Program on International Security Policy at the University of Chicago, in 2015:

"The West is leading Ukraine down the primrose path and the end result is that Ukraine is going to get wrecked [...] What we're doing is in fact encouraging that outcome."



And here's George Kennan in 1997: https://www.netwargamingitalia.net/foru ... -error.35/

"Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking."

We, you and I as Americans, cannot be so stupid. When you are the biggest elephant, you have to make small, careful, deliberate moves. Instead, we act like America is special and that the rules don't apply to us, while forcing them down other people's throats. Even if we agree that Russia is an enemy, we need to understand that pushing NATO to their very doorstep was designed to provoke them and offers nothing in terms of security for the American people. Now, we must not be drawn in to yet another round of fighting other people's battles for them.

Fat Cat this is the kinda dude who wants thousands of others to die for his personal ideals (which are confused and dumb). There is no point. He is manifestly a man in the possession of evil.

Fat Cat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 11:09 pm We, here at IGX, are fortunate to have several Russians both in Russia and abroad, and we should listen to what they have to say so that we can gain a broader, more nuanced view of the situation.

Sangoma and Gene, maybe. WB consistently gives us the RT angle.

Fat Cat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 11:09 pm You know, the party that stoked Russophobia for the past 5 years?

This is really dumb.

1) Stop using the phobia bit. It's newspeak. It's intended to slime people. Opponents of illegal immigration, or excess immigration, aren't xenophobes. Those who say that Russia has acted in ways that were hostile to the U.S. and did so for reasons that have little to do with ordinary statecraft aren't Russophobes, they're telling the truth.

2) Yes, they did. Or maybe DCI Michael Hayden is lying. He might be.

Fat Cat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 11:09 pm Russia =/= Wild Bill, dimwit.

I know that, you mouth breathing slope-headed moron. I like and respect WB a lot.

But if the brings his Putin Fanboy bullshit in the door, I am going to say something. IGx style.

When I think of Zelensky and team, I see a ragtag bunch of English subjects saying fuck that shit and kicking the redcoats in the nuts back in 1776. No way they can defy an empire and gain their own freedom. And yet…

And I don’t really think Russia is the enemy. I don’t believe Russia is much in this fight, they’re getting dragged/shoved by their leader. This is going to return us to the Cold War, when Russia was a pariah state not integral to the rest of the world, with their citizens suffering. What a monumental unnecessary tragedy.

motherjuggs&speed wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 11:57 pm 1) Stop using the phobia bit. It's newspeak. It's intended to slime people. Opponents of illegal immigration, or excess immigration, aren't xenophobes. Those who say that Russia has acted in ways that were hostile to the U.S. and did so for reasons that have little to do with ordinary statecraft aren't Russophobes, they're telling the truth.

I cop to the Russophobia thing, but I was trying to convey an idea and I thought that term would save a lot of typing. Point made and I will stop.

That said, having democrats lay their own failings at the feet of Russians for the past five years has further eroded an already poor situation and is playing out in geopolitics right now. Finally, the US has been acting in ways that were hostile toward Russia and for reasons that have little to do with ordinary statecraft since the 1990s, so where does that leave us? Our ridiculous interventions in Bosnia, Serbia, Kosovo, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, and Syria have given us no leg to stand on now that other countries want to play the same game.

motherjuggs&speed wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 11:57 pm 2) Yes, they did. Or maybe DCI Michael Hayden is lying. He might be.

I did not follow what you are getting at here.

It's true that the U.S. has no credibility in matters of invasion/intervention/etc.. In at least two ways: mendacity and incompetence. This has undermined our ability to use soft power and to enlist the help of other nations in pursuing legitimate goals. For example, Germany was unwilling to do all it could to inderdict A.Q. Khan's acquisition of tools he needed to get North Korea the bomb. There is the justified belief that the U.S. has no right to demand things of others, with our own human rights abuses and our own unlawful and unjustified actions (Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, the list goes on).

It's possible for two things to both be true:

Trump behaved at the very least inappropriately with his Russian contacts.

The Democrats chose to blame everything on Trump.

Mjs you need to look closer at Trump and Russia. The alleged middle-men were all assets if US Intel. Every one of them. HRC blew an entire network of US intel assets working with Trump with her Russiagate hoax.

I personally believe as much as I detest him on every level that Obama was not invovled and just stood aside to let HRC bliw it all up. And he and Biden have lost control of UKR. Withdrawal of US forces is Biden/Barry goal not escalation. This madness is HRC/Bush faction.

We've seen 3 consecutive explosions of US Intel networks in the past 6 yrs. Russiagate (RUS: CIA found top agent dead in car trunk), Af-stan (MENA prob entire thing via abandoned personnel) and UKR (release of slightly wrong invasion plans allowing RUS counter-intel to trace See Gazprom head of security suicide).

Moreover, Trump was shockingly open about how Nord2 would make GER dependent on RUS and enable this very thing.

We are in UKR for one reason: preservation of the money laundering infrastructure. That's it. Nothing more. US pols want ppl to die so they can launder money from US gov and other govs back to themselves. The RUS aspect is a front for that. A fig leaf. UKR is most years the 3rd most corrupt country.

motherjuggs&speed wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 1:11 am It's true that the U.S. has no credibility in matters of invasion/intervention/etc.. In at least two ways: mendacity and incompetence. This has undermined our ability to use soft power and to enlist the help of other nations in pursuing legitimate goals. For example, Germany was unwilling to do all it could to inderdict A.Q. Khan's acquisition of tools he needed to get North Korea the bomb. There is the justified belief that the U.S. has no right to demand things of others, with our own human rights abuses and our own unlawful and unjustified actions (Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, the list goes on).

It's possible for two things to both be true:

Trump behaved at the very least inappropriately with his Russian contacts.

The Democrats chose to blame everything on Trump.

Thoroughly agree about everything except I don't consider Vietnam to be immoral in of itself. Our behavior once we got there...not so great, but the commies were the aggressors and I feel like we were totally justified in killing lots of them there at the invitation of the RVN.

Wild Bill wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:00 pm


Democratic country :)

Save your energy, fellas!

True then, true now. McLuhan to Pound. This is how and why people can go from covid restriction fans to RUS punishers.

Luke wrote: ↑Thu Mar 03, 2022 7:34 am

Wild Bill wrote: ↑Wed Mar 02, 2022 3:00 pm


Democratic country :)

Save your energy, fellas!

I looked into this and the story is inaccurate. This was a border crossing into Poland or Hungary, and the guards--whether right or wrong--were prioritizing native Ukrainians fleeing the warfare. When the foreign students started to agitate, the Ukrainians whooped 'em.

Core commodities racing to all time highs.

Nice job guys.

Absolutely disgusting

I wonder how many ppl who are jazzed up about sanctions know what % belarus and russia have of global potash exports? Or neon?

What % has thought about ramifications of pension fund exposure?

Or one country just saying we control who gets the global reserve currency?

Or what happens when oil goes over $185?

Or what might be the repercussions of a US Senator calling for the assasination of the leader of a nuclear power?

Bro it's about protecting Sovereignty of Ukraine bro. We'll just have to tighten our belts a little!

Hahahahhaha. Suckered again by Int'l Finance you plebs

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... orate-debt

Maybe funniest thing I have ever heard. Wagner Grp is neo-nazi and Azov is Neo-nazi and both funded by Jewish Oligarchs!

"IT'S BLACK AND WHITE BIGOTS. WE'RE THE GOOD GUYS. IT'S NOT ABOUT MONEY LAUNDERING"

Smell the competence