IGX

No argument here.

Publications on American involvement in Ukrainian events:

Ukraine Protests Carefully Orchestrated: The Role of CANVAS, US-Financed “Color Revolution Training Group”

Meet the Americans Who Put Together the Coup in Kiev

Mercenaries took part in Maidan violence – Ex-Ukraine security chief

Exposed: Ukrainian ‘Protesters’ Backed by Kony 2012-Style Scam

The Neo-Nazi Question in Ukraine

Smet wrote:Publications on American involvement in Ukrainian events:

Ukraine Protests Carefully Orchestrated: The Role of CANVAS, US-Financed “Color Revolution Training Group”

I gotta go one at a time through the posts, but I hope the others are better than this. The organization they are talking is based in Belgrade? That den of American imperialism? And their contention is that because a pamphlet they produce was found in both Egypt and Ukraine proves that this is an evil Yankee plot? A pamphlet? You suck at this man.

Here they are:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centre_for ... Strategies

The pamphlets have been available in Ukrainian since the Orange Revolution in 2004. LOL. Their funding:

CANVAS is a non-profit institution which relies solely on private funding; there is no charge for workshops and revolutionary know-how can be downloaded for free on the Internet.[18] CANVAS’ biggest individual funder is its founding member and media mogul, Slobodan Djinovic. Djinovic privately funds about half of CANVAS’ operating costs.[16] CANVAS does not accept funding from individual governments.

Fatty,where is the problem if it is located in belgrade? The serb government wants to be in europe so they do whatever is told them to do. Simply they are sellouts for their personal gain.the vice president is deeply in german's ass. Whatever germany orders he does.they are going with germany and not russia.
I see written that they dont accept donation. So what? Everybody write what they want. Think they will write, we accept everbody money to do eventually dirty work.

unknown wrote:Fatty,where is the problem if it is located in belgrade? The serb government wants to be in europe so they do whatever is told them to do. Simply they are sellouts for their personal gain.the vice president is deeply in german's ass. Whatever germany orders he does.they are going with germany and not russia.
I see written that they dont accept donation. So what? Everybody write what they want. Think they will write, we accept everbody money to do eventually dirty work.

None of that has anything to do with events in Ukraine being a Yankee plot. CANVAS is funded in large part by Slobodan Đinović, he's got that classic American name so you might be right.

Smet wrote:
Meet the Americans Who Put Together the Coup in Kiev

Jesus, so many words dressing up conspiracy theories. I kept promising myself the next paragraph would bring some evidence, but it's tripe. This is typical:

What should we make of all this funding? Some of it looks like private philanthropy, as back in the days when the CIA channeled its money through foundations. Was the Soros and Omidyar money truly private or government money camouflaged to look private? That has to remain an open question. But, with Rybachuk's campaigns, it makes little difference. USAID and other government funding dominated. The US Embassy, through Pact, coordinated most of what Rybachuk did. And, to my knowledge, neither Soros nor Omidyar ever broke from the State Department's central direction.

This reads like some hyperventilating X-files enthusiast wrote these insinuations.

Smet wrote:Publications on American involvement in Ukrainian events:

Ukraine Protests Carefully Orchestrated: The Role of CANVAS, US-Financed “Color Revolution Training Group”

Meet the Americans Who Put Together the Coup in Kiev

Mercenaries took part in Maidan violence – Ex-Ukraine security chief

Exposed: Ukrainian ‘Protesters’ Backed by Kony 2012-Style Scam

The Neo-Nazi Question in Ukraine

This is all working backwards from "of course America is behind the coup in Kiev" to finding any sort of evidence that the end assumption is true. Ignoring all the evidence otherwise.

Have you ever considered that there are a lot of people in the Ukraine who don't like Russia and would like to pull closer to the West? Why did the USSR countries all seek independence in the first place? Occam's razor and all that.

European values
Turchinov said that he himself will go on the first Ukrainian gay parade.

:)))

Smet loves Russia so much he moved to fucking Africa.

deleted

Now the russkies want to take over the free speach forum with their strange writing!

"About situation in Ukraine in short"

U.S. Is Considering Sending Arms To Ukraine: Official

McCain's turn to get Nobel Prize for Peace.

Ukraine crisis: Transcript of leaked Nuland-Pyatt call

Must be lies by Poms. As she said, fuck the EU, no?

Smet wrote:U.S. Is Considering Sending Arms To Ukraine: Official

McCain's turn to get Nobel Prize for Peace.

I thought we were talking about what America has done, not what America is talking about possibly doing at some indefinite point in the future. Silly me.

Smet wrote:Ukraine crisis: Transcript of leaked Nuland-Pyatt call

Must be lies by Poms. As she said, fuck the EU, no?

All this shows is the exact opposite of what you were saying, that there is some EU-USA plot to overthrow Yanukovych. And here you have the erstwhile co-conspirators dismissing each other. Did you ever have a debate class in USSR or is that a silly question?

Fat Cat wrote:

Smet wrote:Ukraine crisis: Transcript of leaked Nuland-Pyatt call

Must be lies by Poms. As she said, fuck the EU, no?

All this shows is the exact opposite of what you were saying, that there is some EU-USA plot to overthrow Yanukovych. And here you have the erstwhile co-conspirators dismissing each other. Did you ever have a debate class in USSR or is that a silly question?

you are arguing with religious believers.

My only point is that Russia's invasion of Ukraine is against the interests of Russians, Russia, and Russian-Ukrainians and that Putin is a dangerous idiot. He couldn't even hold on to a puppet regime, LMAO at rebuilding an empire.

Fat Cat wrote:He couldn't even hold on to a puppet regime

Your first mistake, that that was a puppet regime.
Your others mistakes just derived from the first.

Fat Cat wrote: And here you have the erstwhile co-conspirators dismissing each other. Did you ever have a debate class in USSR or is that a silly question?

Not trying to prove something, but is it really impossible that co-conspirators can plot not only against common foe but against each other the same time?

Deleted. Waste of time.

This explains what's really happening. Page 108.

http://msxnet.org/orwell/print/1984.pdf

Indeed, ignorance is strength. Only naive (and of course ignorant) can believe that events like those in Libya, Egypt, Ukraine, Serbia and elsewhere are isolated and spontaneous.

Smet wrote:This explains what's really happening. Page 108.

http://msxnet.org/orwell/print/1984.pdf

Indeed, ignorance is strength. Only naive (and of course ignorant) can believe that events like those in Libya, Egypt, Ukraine, Serbia and elsewhere are isolated and spontaneous.

In your worldview Slavs and Arabs are helpless children led by their American overlords. I like it.

Not at all, they are caught between several forces. USA, yes. But also Russia, China and major European countries. The adjectives good or bad are not applicable here. At the end it's all bad.

There is never anything good in any conflict, and invasion of Afghanistan by USSR was as bad and immoral as its current invasion by USA. Similarly, current participation and interference of foreign forces in the Ukrainian conflict is not good for everyone, especially people living in the region. The point is, this is not Russia against Ukraine, it is Russia against USA and the West.

Russia and Europe/USA have considered each other enemies since socialist Russian Revolution and stepped on each other's toes continuously. Note how I avoid marking any of them good or bad. Current events is just another rounds of that struggle.

It is tragic that smaller nations get caught in the brawl. Stalin and Hitler divided Europe in 1939. About the same time Brittain and France decided to chop off the Sudettenland from Czechoslovakia and ban ditto Hitler. Incidentally, the majority of population wanted this at the time.

After war - Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin drew new lines in Europe once again. At the same time USSR facilitates drawing a wedge in the middle of the British empire: Israel. Incidentally, it is also a wedge in the middle of the Arabic Holy Land, and Arabs are forever pissed with the West for this. Fast forward to 1990 - new shuffle, now from the position of Western strength and Russian weakness with their imbecile alcoholic president.

Now Russia has a strong president (again I am not marking him as good or bad, it depends on different points of view) and the re-shuffle is initiated once again.

It is immoral, like all politics. Just don't think for a second that events of such significance and magnitude are as simple as spontaneous popular appraising and suppression by Bad communists. If, let's say, an anti-American appraising started in Mexico you could be sure it is the work of Russia, via various innocent proxies, of course. I just don't believe that USA and major European countries can be so incompetent in running foreign affairs and not have a finger in the pot.